Eat Smarter with Dr. Annie Fenn of The Brain Health Kitchen
Show Snapshot:
Upgrade your brain health one bite, snack, and meal at a time with science-backed, brain-friendly eating ideas from Dr. Annie Fenn, a physician, chef, and the author of “The Brain Health Kitchen: Preventing Alzheimer’s Through Food.” Learn the top ten brain-smart foods to make your brain younger, sharper, and healthier. Concerned about your cognitive health? Discover how what we choose to eat—or not—affects our risk of Alzheimer’s and other dementias. Dr. Fenn covers cooking techniques that optimize (and degrade) food nutrients and shares how to stock a brain-friendly pantry with powerful neuroprotective foods. We dish on mouth-watering recipes like creamy cannellini bean soup, caramelized apple and quinoa pancakes, a blueberry dressing to add sizzle to a kale salad, and mmmmm—chocolate. Get ready to stock your pantry with brain-boosting goodness!
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The Brain Health Kitchen: Preventing Alzheimer's Through Food
Quotable:
There are 10 brain healthy food groups that can protect your brain from Alzheimer's disease and reduce the risk by as much as 53%. Which is astounding, right? And there's also a list of foods that can accelerate brain aging—foods that you should limit or avoid for a healthy brain.
Transcript:
Katie Fogarty 0:04
Welcome to A Certain Age, a show for women are unafraid to age out loud. I'm your host, Katie Fogarty. Beauties, we have a power-packed show that is going to upgrade your brain health by the time we are done. Seriously! We are getting the down low on how to make your brain younger, sharper, more vibrant, and much less prone to dementia. And we're getting it from a total pro. My guest today is Dr. Annie Fenn, a physician, chef, and the author of The Brain Health Kitchen, preventing Alzheimer's through food. This science based cookbook and care manual for the brain is designed to help fend off Alzheimer's and other dementias while still preparing delicious food. If you want to be proactive about your brain health, if you want to stock your pantry with brain health superfoods, or if you are craving fresh recipe inspo like creamy cannelini bean soup with frizzled sage and breadcrumbs or carmelized apple and quinoa pancakes, stick around. We have a delicious, nutritious, fun and fabulous show on deck. Welcome, Annie.
Dr. Annie Fenn 1:07
Thank you for having me. It's such a pleasure to be here, Katie.
Katie Fogarty 1:11
Oh, I'm really excited. I love nothing more than opening up a great cookbook. It's so fun to be able to connect with the person who created it. I've got so many questions. And my first is, you open your book by saying that you are a physician who has always loved food but you didn't choose to become a culinary educator and voice for Alzheimer's prevention. Instead, Alzheimer's chose you. Can you share with our listeners what started you on this journey of sharing food education for brain health?
Dr. Annie Fenn 1:39
Oh, sure. So um, yeah, my path from physician to chef is not exactly typical. But I think it's, I think it's what happens when you follow a passion, even though you don't know exactly where that's going to take you. That's sort of what happened to me. I was an obstetrician gynecologist, practicing for 20 years, the last eight years of my practice I was focused exclusively on menopausal medicine. And I loved it. I loved every minute of it. But there was some point, about 20 years in, where I just felt like I wanted to make a change. Perhaps being a physician was just too unhealthy of a lifestyle for me. I was suffering from not getting enough sleep, not really seeing my kids enough and they were growing up really quickly. So I decided to retire from medicine and I was 45 at the time. And I wasn't sure exactly what I was going to do but I'd always been a passionate home cook. And so, you know, one of the things that I'd always wanted to do is go to culinary school, so that's what I did. I went to culinary school, I started teaching healthy cooking classes in my community, because honestly, a lot of the problems that I saw even in OBGYN, I felt like the root cause was from poor lifestyle nutrition choices, like a lot of the surgeries and medications that I prescribed, you know, could probably be prevented if people were taking better care of themselves. And I really thought this all came down to food. So I started to focus on food, healthy eating, how to make it easy, how to make it delicious. And then somewhere a few years into my culinary journey, my mom was diagnosed with an early stage of Alzheimer's disease called mild cognitive impairment, which went on to become Alzheimer's. And you know, nothing makes a doctor do more of a deep dive into the science than when something happens to a family member. So I, I made it my business to learn everything there was about slowing down Alzheimer's or even preventing it. And I found this huge link between nutrition and lifestyle that back in 2013/14, no one really knew about. So that's why I decided to focus on The Brain Health Kitchen, launch it as a cooking school because what better way to learn healthy lifestyle and food tips than in a cooking class situation. I just wanted to make it fun for people. And that's what I've been doing ever since 2015.
Katie Fogarty 3:59
And we're so grateful that you do because this is something that you know, it touches so many lives and impacts so many people who, you know, who have loved ones who are experiencing dementia and Alzheimer's. And you know, I'm sorry that your own personal story is what put you on this path. But we are fortunate that you've created this incredible body of work that the rest of us can benefit from. I adored this book. There's so many droolworthy recipes in it. But you also start off with a lot of the sort of science around food, around brain health. And you identify in the book, sort of 10 food groups with powerful neuro protective properties. As a starting point, can you share with our listeners what the link is that you found between Alzheimer's and food?
Dr. Annie Fenn 4:43
Absolutely. So even back in 2015 there was a solid amount of data in my medical journals. These are scientific peer reviewed papers, you know, published in standard journals throughout the world, showing that certain dietary patterns actually can slow down brain aging. And when you think about Alzheimer's and also other neurodegenerative diseases such as Parkinson's or vascular dementia, it's really an accelerated form of aging of the brain. Of course, all of our brains are aging, some at faster rates than others. So to find that food was actually instrumental in slowing this down, was very exciting to me, and to see that the science was solid. So one of the, one of the dietary patterns that has been most studied is the Mediterranean diet. And that should be of no surprise to anyone, it's very famously good for you. It's always a top rated diet for health for many, many reasons. But back in the, you know, early 2010s or so, scientists were starting to look at the Mediterranean diet through the lens of brain health. By then we'd already demonstrated that it reduces cardiovascular disease, like following the Mediterranean diet reduces heart attacks and strokes and things like that. And then researchers started to say, well, if it's so good for your heart, which we know is an important component of brain health, then why don't we look at it through brain specific criteria. And that is where the 10 brain healthy food groups came from. It comes from this study called the MIND diet study, the M-I-N-D diet study from Rush University, published in 2015, a follow up trial was published in 2021. And this basically showed that there are 10 brain healthy food groups that can protect your brain from Alzheimer's disease and reduce the risk by as much as 53%. Which is astounding, right. And there's also a list of foods that can accelerate brain aging, foods that you should limit or avoid for a healthy brain.
Katie Fogarty 6:40
Ooh, we're going to explore all of these. So these 10, sort of food groups with these powerful neuroprotective properties, can you give our listeners a list of what they are?
Dr. Annie Fenn 6:50
Absolutely. So some of these will be no surprise to anyone and other ones might be, you know, kind of interesting, based on, you know, what you may already know about food and health. So the first one is berries. Berries is the only fruit that is mentioned as a brain health food group. And that's because berries has its own body of data to show that it improves memory, reduces Alzheimer's risk, reduces dementia in older adults. So berries is number one. Leafy greens is number two. Now in the Mediterranean diet, if you can picture the Mediterranean pyramid, which I know we've all seen, your leafy greens is mixed in with all the vegetables, right. But in the MIND diet, they pulled leafy greens out as its own brain food group, because it also has its own pile of data to say that it slows down brain aging. So berries, leafy greens, vegetables, beans, and legumes, nuts, and whole grains. These are the foundational plant based brain healthy food groups. In addition, fish and seafood, poultry, extra virgin olive oil is its own food group and it's recommended that that is the primary cooking oil for brain healthy diet. And then the tenth one is kind of in flux. In the original studies, they included red wine, as a nod to the Mediterranean lifestyle. In the subsequent MIND diet trial that was dropped. And in my book, I have my own tenth food group, it's about healthy drinks. And I include coffee, I include tea, things like, you know, what's the difference between green tea versus herbal tea, and water, which is probably the brain healthiest drink of all.
Katie Fogarty 8:23
I love that, it's so clear. And you did share that the Mediterranean diet is sort of so famous. It's wonderful that we've added sort of this new category, the MIND diet. You know, the foods that you just outlined for us berries, oranges, you know, pears, we've got leafy greens, green teas, these are things that people love to eat, they're delicious. You've just shared they're good for our brain. Why? What makes these types of foods so neuroprotective?
Dr. Annie Fenn 8:48
Well, that was a big question that I was kind of grappling with when I was writing the book, like how do you communicate what it is about all these foods have the commonality being that in studies, they reduce Alzheimer's risk. 53% is astounding, as I mentioned before. So what I did was I came up with something called the Four F's, and the four F's of brain healthy food is my way of describing what all these things have in common. So number one, they all contain brain friendly fats. Now, there's a lot of talk about, you know, which fats are good for you, which fats you should avoid, but we know what brain friendly fats are. These are the fats that your brain thrives on. The brain healthy diet should be primarily monounsaturated fats and polyunsaturated fats with a very small percentage of actual saturated fats, and almost no manmade fats or trans fats.
Okay, so good fats are good for the brain. So that's our first F. We're going to head into a quick break, but when we come back, I want to pick this up and hear about the other three.
Katie Fogarty 9:48
[AD BREAK]
Annie, we're back from the break, we talked about good fats and their neuroprotective capacity. What are the other three F's?
Dr. Annie Fenn 9:58
So the second F is something that your listeners may or may not have heard of. It's a category called flavonoids, flavonoid rich foods. Now flavonoids are plant compounds. They are considered, you know, bioactive substances that have a particular impact on brain health. Flavonoids are basically what make plant foods colorful. They are the actual plant pigments in things like a red bell pepper or green zucchini or purple squash, things like that. So when you eat a lot of different colorful foods, like nutritionists have been telling us for years to eat the rainbow, the reason is, these flavonoid compounds pass the blood brain barrier, get into the brain and they have particular action in improving memory and blocking oxidative stress which causes chronic inflammation in the brain. So flavonoids is an incredibly important body of research now, we're looking at how flavonoid rich diets can prevent Alzheimer's and dementia, but also how young adults and people at midlife who consume a flavanoid rich diet can have better memory skills. I know we all need more memory skills, right?
Katie Fogarty 9:58
Yes.
Dr. Annie Fenn 10:22
Things like executive function, processing speed, working memory. These are things that, you know, a lot of midlife people struggle with every day. And eating a flavonoid rich diet may help.
Katie Fogarty 11:21
Okay, I love this. So that's, and by the way, I enjoy eating the rainbow. It may have taken me, you know, several decades to get there. But I'm, you know, I'm definitely eating the rainbow. So those are, so we've done two. We've done healthy fats, right, with flavonoids, what are Fs number three and four?
Dr. Annie Fenn 11:38
So number three is fiber. I think fiber is the magic macronutrient in a brain healthy diet. We know it's important for gut health and that's a big part of it. You know, with a lot of what we've been learning about, about what is good for brain health, comes from the research on the gut microbiome. This is the, you know, community of trillions and trillions of microbiota that live in your gastrointestinal tract. And it turns out that they are very active in producing certain substances, you know, they might be like hormones, or other anti inflammatory things that actually impact brain health. So we're learning a lot about the gut health, and how important it is to have a diverse and vibrant number of different microbiota in your gut. And the way you do that is you feed them, they live on fiber, good quality fiber, and where you get fiber is from plant foods. That's why the first, you know, six food groups are all fiber rich foods, berries, leafy greens, veg, beans, nuts, whole grains. That's one thing that unites all of these food groups that are the basis of the brain healthy diet, is they're all rich in fiber.
Katie Fogarty 12:47
I love this. Okay, and so number four is what?
Dr. Annie Fenn 12:51
So number four is fit, f-i-t. And what I mean by that is, you know, I don't think that there is one way to follow a brain healthy diet, you will hear that you have to be vegan, or you have to follow a Mediterranean diet, or be pescetarian. And there are merits to all of these dietary patterns in terms of reducing Alzheimers and helping your memory, etc. But I think that the most important thing to think about when you're embarking on eating for your brain health, is that this has to be something that makes sense for you. You know, it has to be a dietary pattern that fits your life, your budget, whether or not you like to cook, you know, your proclivity for eating certain foods, how you grew up, your ethnic background. To say that the Mediterranean diet is like the best way to eat for brain health really ignores a lot of the other dietary patterns around the world that are traditional, that are probably just as good for brain health, they just haven't been studied. Things like the Latin American heritage diet, the African American Heritage diet, the Asian American heritage diet. These dietary patterns, if you line up their food pyramids right next to the Mediterranean one, they are very, very similar in terms of their brain food components. So I think that everyone should probably start by building their own brain health food pyramid, and by that I mean, you know, choosing the foods from the brain healthy food groups that you've really love, that you'd like to cook, you like to eat, that fits your budget, all of those things, and then adding in as many as you can.
Katie Fogarty 14:16
Yeah, I love this notion too, that you need to pick something that fits your lifestyle and it just feels more inclusive to pull in these other cultural food traditions. Because you know, I lived in Japan after college for two years teaching English and I've really developed an affinity for that food and I love Korean food and kimchi and all of these different, like miso paste, all these different things that are not necessarily incorporated in a western or Mediterranean diet. But I've learned over the years from reading recipes about them that they're so healthy, they're so good for your gut biome and all this stuff. So I love this notion of sort of casting a more inclusive, open, you know, approach to what you're bringing into your kitchen. I know for you -
Dr. Annie Fenn 15:00
Yes, absolutely. And I also wanted to add that, you know, when I wrote The Brain Health Kitchen book, I had in mind that I wanted to write it for everyone, like people, you know, some people are whole food plant based, like they don't eat any animal products at all. And so I have recipes in there, they're easily veganized, or they're already vegan. I wrote it for vegetarians, I wrote for people that eat meat and eggs and poultry. You know, if you don't eat those foods, you can just eliminate that food group or that chapter. So I really wanted to throw a wide net, and make brain healthy eating accessible to everyone. And like you said, just make it really inclusive.
Katie Fogarty 15:33
Yeah, and not only that, but just delicious. I'm not kidding when I said I was drooling over some of these recipes. And we're gonna get into a few of them in a few minutes. But I do want to turn now to the fact that you outlined that food choices are really only one part of the equation. Yes, what we're putting into our grocery cart, what we're cooking, what we're eating, matters but cooking methods are also, have a star role to play, right? And you recommend certain cooking methods that are better at preserving nutrients than others. What brain friendly cooking methods do you recommend for our listeners to preserve optimal nutrition?
Dr. Annie Fenn 16:07
Well, the mantra for cooking in a brain healthy way is low and slow. So this gets into the issue of inflammatory particles that we create in foods. For example, we know that ultra processed foods are bad for us, right. And the reason is, scientists are discovering, is if they contain a lot of AGE's or, advanced glycation end products, these are inflammatory particles that are created in food when you apply high heat, especially in the presence of sugar, and protein. So think of a piece of barbecue chicken that you put on a really hot grill, you get grill marks on it, you slather it with barbecue sauce, you know, it gets really dark and charry. We already know that those char marks on food have carcinogenic, you know, materials in them. But now we also know that they contain AGEs. AGEs actually get into your bloodstream, they pass the blood brain barrier. They get into the brain cells and cause inflammation and oxidative stress. They are found to be accumulating in the brain cells of people with Alzheimer's disease. So getting back to cooking, my cooking methods are all designed to reduce AGE formation in foods. So, low and slow means you don't use high heat, you don't use direct heat, you don't really fry food, except maybe occasionally as a treat. You can barbecue but I'd like people to use indirect grilling, or have a barrier between your food and the grill. For example when I barbecue I use like a cast iron pan, you know, or a grill basket or a cedar plank, for example. So that the food is not in direct contact with the heat. In my kitchen, I'll use, I'll roast food but I tend not to cook food over 375 in the oven. And when I'm cooking in a pan, like sauteing or searing, I keep the heat at a medium high or medium.
Katie Fogarty 18:00
And so we're talking about braising, right? I mean, when you say low and slow is this when you're, is this like in crock pot, are you doing it over a big, kind of one of those big cast iron, you know, skillets with a pan over it, how do we cook low and slow?
Dr. Annie Fenn 18:16
Well braising is a fantastic way, because whenever you add liquid, it sort of, you know, equalizes all that impact of heat on the food. So if you have a slow cooker that's great, an instant pot is also a really great way to cook even though it seems counter intuitive with all that high pressure and everything. Pressure cooking has been found to preserve nutrients and retain, you know, liquid in the foods which preserves, reduces AGE formation. But you can also cook without any liquid at all, just cook at slightly lower temperature. For example, I have a slow roasted salmon recipe in the book. It's one of the most popular recipes, it comes with an avocado butter on top. It's basically salmon that you put in a sheet pan over vegetables and beans and some other things. But I cook that in a pretty low oven, you know around 300 degrees. And when you do that instead of, you know, something at around 400 or 425, what happens is you preserve the health via the delicate brain friendly fats in that fish. There are omega three fatty acids in fatty fish like salmon. And these are really important brain health nutrients. But if you overcook your fish, they start to seep out and you don't really get the benefit from that anymore.
Katie Fogarty 19:30
Okay, smart. I, also you had me at avocado butter because that sounds amazing. I need to, I need to check that out. I thought this book was really eye opening. You do a lot of myth busting in it, you share that nightshades, which include tomatoes but you know bell peppers, eggplants, are anti inflammatory foods. You actually shared what I thought was a fun fact, that eggplants are actually berries. And you bust this myth, which I have actually read, that nightshades cause inflammation in the body. You say, not true. What are some other common myths that you find people, you know, believe regarding brain healthy food?
Dr. Annie Fenn 20:06
Oh, I love busting myths, because not that difficult to do. All you have to do is look at the science, read it, digest it, I translate that to you. There's really no data whatsoever that says that nightshades are bad for everyone, there's always going to be a small percentage of people who react poorly to a certain type of food. So it can be nightshades or anything else. Another really common myth is that grains are bad for the brain. So you, you may notice I mentioned whole grains as one of the brain healthy food groups, whole grains are actually anti inflammatory for most people. Now, the reason this gets confusing is because there is about 1% of the population that is celiac, these are people that cannot eat gluten, or wheat, barley type containing foods, because it is very inflammatory for them, they have a disease that that cannot process it. And then there's another 3% of people who have either an allergy or sensitivity to gluten or some other component of whole grains. So that's less than 4% of the population. 96% of the rest of the people should be including whole grains in their diet. And then the MIND diet study, the one that put up those great numbers, they actually recommend including whole grains, small portion, three times a day, three small portions of whole grains a day.
Katie Fogarty 21:30
So what, if you are building a brain friendly plate, you know, what are we putting, we're gonna talk about specific recipes in a minute, but what are some generalities? What does a brain friendly meal look like if we were dividing our plate into different portions? You've identified sort of 10 food groups, are we trying to incorporate one each meal? Is it throughout a day, is it throughout a week? What is our, what are our basic numbers?
Dr. Annie Fenn 21:54
Oh, this is such a great question, Katie, because people get hung up on plate to plate, day to day eating. And I think that's a pitfall for just frustration in terms of your overall dietary pattern. If you're following, say a standard American diet, which we know is a really unhealthy way to eat, which includes a lot of things on my six foods to limit or avoid, like fast food, fried food, pastries, sweets, dairy, ultra processed foods, sweetened drinks, artificially sweetened drinks, alcohol, things like that, then you probably need to change it up a lot. But the way to do that is to eliminate these foods to limit or avoid, and then think about eating on a weekly basis. Okay, so the the brain healthy food groups in the MIND diet, which is a great template for learning, is, looks at including these foods over the course of a week. Okay? For example, you know, beans and lagoons is a, is a brain food group and the recommendation is to have about two or three servings over the course of a week. So you don't have to eat beans every day, but if you don't eat any beans at all, you might want to start introducing them slowly. Other foods you should eat every day, like leafy greens, vegetables, berries, nuts and seeds are something that can be up to four times a week, more if you'd like them. But four times a week seems to be the, you know, the really good spot where we know that reduces cardiovascular risk and also impacts your brain health. Fish and seafood, two to three servings a week is probably a good, a good measure. But if you only have one serving of fish or seafood a week, you're probably gonna get enough brain health nutrients from that.
Katie Fogarty 23:29
Especially if you're picking things like salmon or, you know, like sardines, or you know, anchovies all, all of which I love, so I feel lucky. I love this notion of this weekly cadence because it makes me think of way back when I was a young mom struggling to get my kids to eat certain things. And I found so much relief when a pediatrician said to me, you know, think about it for over a week. You know, because the struggle with every meal to get them to eat something felt overwhelming, but when I looked at it with a, with a sort of a week's, you know, running room, it felt much more manageable. So I'm, I'm so happy.
Dr. Annie Fenn 24:04
It's the exact same concept as if we're feeding our kids. You know, they might have a really bad day, they might have a really bad meal. And if you just let yourself recover from that, that's where you start with the brain healthy diet. And when you look at your plate, I mean, unless you're a whole food plant based vegan vegetarian, if you're an omnivore and eat pretty much from all the food groups, three quarters of your plate should be plant foods. This is not just vegetables, but they could be you know, whole grains, beans and legumes, vegetables, leafy greens, things like that.
Katie Fogarty 24:36
And everything you just outlined feels doable and when we look at this sort of weekly cadence it feels you know, very, very doable. The book is full of so many wonderful, practical recommendations for upgrading food that we already eat, which I want all listeners to know. You do not need to learn, you know, a gazillion new recipes. You share ideas for adding wholegrain cornmeal and blackberries and blueberries to upgrade cornbread. I paid attention to that because my family loves cornbread, we eat a lot. You know we're in these cold, winter ski season months and we eat a lot of chili and we eat a lot of cornbread and we can upgrade things that we're already making. Brain healthy food does not simply need to mean more salmon and blueberries, you offer a lot of, you know, hearty one pot ideas. A brothy chicken with white beans, tomato, and pesto had me drooling and caught my eye cause I want to add that to my list. What is a winner recipe in this book that you look forward to making every time the temperatures dip?
Dr. Annie Fenn 25:32
Oh gosh, there's so many. I really love one pot dishes. I mean, I am busy just like all of you and all of your listeners, right? So I'm really trying to find ways to get a hearty, nourishing, bright and healthy meal ready for you with minimal prep and minimal time. And sometimes that means one pot. There is a recipe for chili in my book that uses bison and cacao powder. And, you know, I add more veggies, of course. I have some poblano peppers that you chop up and put in there. So for me, this is a brain healthy upgrade to a common comfort food. And I'm more likely to make like a cashew lime crema to put on top of it than a bunch of shredded cheddar. But, you know, you can kind of ease into the dairy free options in, you know, in the way that you cook.
Katie Fogarty 26:21
And what are some ideas for starting our day? Because I find, I'm sure I'm like a lot of our listeners right, when you start the day off on the right foot of like I'm exercising in the morning at yoga class, I'm making better choices throughout the day with what I'm eating and just, you know, like a good behavior builds on another. So if we wanted to start our day with a brain friendly breakfast, what do you recommend?
Dr. Annie Fenn 26:41
Oh, I'm a big believer in having protein first thing in the day. And even if you skip breakfast, your first meal should be protein rich. So I lean on savory foods for morning foods a lot. Here's something that I make in my family all the time, is the salsa poached eggs with black beans in the book. And basically I take a can of black beans, I take almond milk or cashew milk, sometimes I make this from scratch, sometimes it just comes from the grocery store. And I put that in a skillet and you know, get it all sort of saucy so it's sort of like a creamy white sauce with the beans. I add a jar of green salsa verde. And this is an example of how I like to lean on, you know, minimally processed foods that I think of as conveniently healthy, like canned beans, salsa verde, marinara sauce. Not everything has to be from scratch, right? But you just have to read labels really carefully when you do shop.
Katie Fogarty 27:34
Yeah.
Dr. Annie Fenn 27:35
So the salsa, the almond milk, the beans, they go into a pot, and then when it's all warm and saucy, you poach eggs right in the sauce. And when those are done, you have your salsa poached eggs. I served it with sliced avocado, some scallions, tortillas if I have them. This is something that we eat all the time in my family.
Katie Fogarty 27:54
Annie, you're having me over for breakfast. You don't know it yet, but that sounds delicious.
Dr. Annie Fenn 28:00
There's another variation of that recipe that uses pepper, red peppers, chicken sausage, you know, you can opt out of the sausage part if you want, or just use ground chicken or ground turkey. There's a million variations on this recipe that you can make.
Katie Fogarty 28:15
Yum, yum, and yum, that sounds great. And you jogged a thought when you said, you know, you can sometimes use storebought things, it doesn't all have to be homemade, you know, read your labels carefully. I recently learned of an app, which I'm just going to share with listeners, it's called Trash Panda. And it is a label reading app. So when you, you can use it if you install it on your phone, you scan the barcode of any product anywhere, and I've tested it at every store and, you know, Whole Foods or my Stop and Shop, my local market, when you scan any label it kind of calls out things to pay attention to, it shares what, if there's like, you know, white sugar in it, it shares what's healthy that's in it. And I found it to be really, really useful. It's a quick little shortcut for anyone who wants more information while they're shopping. So I'm putting that out there. Speaking of more information, we've been talking about some of the foods we want to be including in our diet, these sort of 10, neutroprotective superfood groups. But you mentioned there are six foods you know, broad food categories that we should be either avoiding or limiting. Can we talk about that in a little bit more detail now?
Dr. Annie Fenn 29:23
Absolutely. So in the original MIND diet study, they had five food groups to limit or avoid. And when you think about these five food groups, fast and fried food, pastries and sweets, cheese, butter, red meat, those were the original five. You know, they're all very high in saturated fat. They're all very high in these inflammatory particles we've been talking about because of, you know, largely processed food. And what they did was they limited these in this population of about 1000 people that they studied over five years, and basically by limiting these foods from the diet, they are driving down the sat-fat in their diet. And that seems to be, you know, one of the secret ingredients of having a brain healthy diet, like we talked about. It's mostly monounsaturated fats, it's very low in saturated fat, it's all whole foods, it's very low in processed foods. So these are a good example of reducing processed and sat-fat foods in your diet. Now in my book, I changed a little bit because of new data that has come out since 2015. And there's been a lot of it, and I broke it down to make it a little bit more user friendly for people, for example, fast and fried food. You know, we all know what this is right? In the MIND diet study, the recommendation is to eat no more than one meal a day, that's fast or fried food. And I would say that, you know, I would eliminate fast food entirely. And fried food, you know, it depends. Every once in a while I look at it as a treat food. But if you're getting, if you're eating fried food, it's best if it was fried in olive oil, like say, when you're, let's say you're on a trip and you get a fried artichoke that's been cooked in olive oil, it's a delicious treat that you can get, you know, when you're visiting Italy. That is something that I would not turn down, I think it's a delicious thing to eat. But eating fried food on a regular basis is not what we should be doing for our brains. The other category is pastries and sweets. Now, I love sweets, sweets are part of my brain food pyramid that I created, but I have a rule when I eat sweets. They can't be processed, they can't be ultra processed, they don't come from a package or a box at the grocery store. You know, they should be made with whole foods. And if you include sugar in a sweet, say, like a cookie or cake or something like that, there has to be a lot of fiber. Now when the food is rich in fiber, it slows down the absorption of sugar, and how it hits your bloodstream. Because one pathway to Alzheimer's disease or memory problems is a metabolic pathway. We know our bodies become insulin resistant over time, but our brain does too. So that's one of the reasons that fiber is, you know, one of those four Fs, it mitigates the effects of any sugar that we might have in our diet. And let's face it, our diets are not going to be entirely sugar free. Right?
Katie Fogarty 32:07
Right. It is tricky. I mean, I love chocolate. And you have a recipe in your book, the salted chocolate and olive oil gelato that, you know, I was definitely intrigued by. You know, there are, you do offer sort of sweet tooth-some looking recipes in this book too, for people who do have a sweet tooth.
Dr. Annie Fenn 32:25
Absolutely. And one of the other, you know, things on my list is sweet and artificially sweetened drinks as a food to avoid. Well, it's not really even a food. But um, it's so important to avoid consuming sugar in a liquid form.
Katie Fogarty 32:41
Why? Tell us.
Dr. Annie Fenn 32:41
We know it's some of the worst food for your metabolic health, because it just dumps into your bloodstream really quickly. It's more likely if you have a tendency towards diabetes later in life, it's more likely to elicit an insulin response because your blood sugar goes up rapidly. Most healthy people can handle that, but as you get older, then sometimes it's not as easy and over time, you know, high sugar in your diet, especially consumed through sugary drinks can really impact your metabolic health. And it seems it's a component of getting Alzheimer's for many, many people. So when you start to wean off sugary drinks, and I'm putting artificially sweetened drinks in this category too, for another reason, when you start to wean off these sugary things, your palate changes, you start to not expect everything to taste so sweet. So like if you just come from a normal standard American diet where you're consuming a lot of sugar and you're drinking soda pop or whatever, and you have one of my cookies from the book, it's not going to taste all that sweet to you. But if you've been weaning off, you know, these added forms of sugar or these refined forms of sugar in your life for a month or two or maybe longer than these sweets will taste sweet to you. If that makes any sense.
Katie Fogarty 33:56
No it totally makes sense.
Dr. Annie Fenn 33:58
We need to change the way we experience sugar and sweets. I tend to use more natural forms of sugar, such as dates or applesauce, honey, maple syrup. Sometimes I use coconut sugar, not that it's all that much better than white sugar, but it's got a richer flavor so I can get away with using less of it. And like I said with all of my, all of my baked goods and desserts, there's a lot of fiber in there in the form of whole grain flours, or nuts. Even like ground up nut flour, like almond flour, not only makes the dish sometimes more delicious, it actually improves the glycemic index of the food.
Katie Fogarty 34:37
Yup, we have to reprogram our taste buds. I'm a little jealous of all the nut based dishes that you have in there because one of my three children has a nut allergy so we have to avoid those. So we're not able to cook with that, but it's a wonderful option for people who do have that choice.
Dr. Annie Fenn 34:57
Well you know, seeds were not a food group in the original studies, I added that when I wrote the book. So I changed the nut food group to nuts and seeds, because a lot of people are allergic to nuts, and you can access the same brain health nutrients and fats you get from nuts in seeds. So you'll notice in my nuts and seeds chapter, I cook with a lot of pumpkin seeds, sesame seeds, chia seeds, hemp seeds, these are super high protein foods too. And they give you flavonoids, they give you fiber, they're delicious. They make they make everything taste better.
Katie Fogarty 35:31
You have so many wonderful recipes. I mean, everyone needs to check this book out. It's, it'll fire up your tastebuds, you'll be excited. And the best thing is that it just, you know, when you think about brain healthy cooking, if you're thinking about it just when you hear that term, you might be thinking, you know, salmon, blueberries, and feeling a sense of scarcity sometimes around your choices, but this book with its 100 recipes plus makes clear that there's so many wonderful, delicious, nutritious options out there. It's really exciting. We're gonna be heading into our speed round in just one minute, but I want to do a quick switch of gears before we do. I know that you launched The Brain Health Kitchen in 2015 you shared. You published his book relatively recently, it came out in 2023. But your offerings really extend far beyond a cookbook, I would love for you to just share with our listeners who are fired up and excited about making, you know, brain healthy food part of their 2024, what else does The Brain Health Kitchen platform offer?
Dr. Annie Fenn 36:30
Oh, sure. So The Brain Health Kitchen book launched in January 2023. So it's been a really fun busy year for me getting the word out about the book. But the same time I launched the book, I also launched a newsletter on substack. And the reason for that was there's actually, even though this book is jam packed with science and recipes, we actually could not put more information in this book and keep the trim size on task. I had so much more I wanted to share. There's a lot of science that didn't fit in the book. And so I write twice weekly to my newsletter community on substack at brainhealthkitchen.substack.com. I write about new studies that come out, I write about new recipes that I'm excited about, I give guides like I just did a chocolate guide. There was some information this year about heavy metals that are, you know, contaminating chocolate and different chocolate products, so we went into that. I talk about supplements, I did a supplement guide, you know, are there supplements you should take for your brain health, are they science based, are there ones you should avoid. So I like to be very current with the information I'm giving people and the newsletter gives me a great platform to do that.
Katie Fogarty 37:42
So many great resources. I'm checking that chocolate got out because I love chocolate.
Dr. Annie Fenn 37:47
Yeah, you and me both.
Katie Fogarty 37:49
All right, time for our speed round because our time is coming to a close. This is one to two word answers. Are you ready?
Dr. Annie Fenn 37:56
Yes.
Katie Fogarty 37:56
This brain health pantry staple is always in my grocery cart:
Dr. Annie Fenn 38:02
Canned beans.
Katie Fogarty 38:04
I love this brain health superfood:
Dr. Annie Fenn 38:08
Blackberries.
Katie Fogarty 38:10
Favorite brain healthy nut:
Dr. Annie Fenn 38:12
Pistachios.
Katie Fogarty 38:14
This is my go to brain health snack:
Dr. Annie Fenn 38:17
Dates with peanut butter.
Katie Fogarty 38:19
Love it. Okay, you have a recipe called “Your New Favorite Kale Salad.” What is the secret ingredient that makes this delicious?
Dr. Annie Fenn 38:28
Oh, I created this recipe for my husband who does not like kale. And my young adult sons who also don't really love it. So I wanted to make a kale salad that was just really easy because one way to make kale softer and easier to chew is by massaging it. So instead I used a blueberry infused dressing, where you sauté blueberries, they can be fresh or frozen, in a pan with olive oil, with some shallots, so it's like a savory take on berry. And then you blend it up. And the acidity from the dressing actually really marinates the kale. And so it's a nice salad, you can make it ahead of time. And then it had lots of like yummy things in it like sliced almonds and roasted beets and slivered carrots. So it feels substantial.
Katie Fogarty 39:13
Phenomenal, phenomenal. I actually have shallots and blueberries at home right now but I'm missing kale. So that may be my supermarket stop on the way home that sounds delicious.
Dr. Annie Fenn 39:22
Yeah, and then just add salmon or chicken or shrimp or tofu and you have a whole meal.
Katie Fogarty 39:27
Love it. Alright, consider adding more of this spice or herb to your brain health culinary toolkit:
Dr. Annie Fenn 39:34
Cumin.
Katie Fogarty 39:35
If I could wave a magic wand and take this one product off of the shelves of grocery stores, it would be this item:
Dr. Annie Fenn 39:43
Coconut oil.
Katie Fogarty 39:44
Ooh, ah, I didn't see that coming. All right. And can I ask why? It's more than one word, but tell me.
Dr. Annie Fenn 39:50
People think it's a brain health food but it's not. It's actually mostly saturated fat. So people consume it thinking they're doing something good for their health, when studies show it actually raises your cholesterol, which we know is a risk factor for Alzheimer's and dementia.
Katie Fogarty 40:04
Okay, so I'm so happy we had this conversation. All right, finally your one word answer to complete this sentence, as I age I feel:
Dr. Annie Fenn 40:13
Nourished.
Katie Fogarty 40:14
Beautiful. This book is full of so many wonderful strategies, recipes, the beverages to drink, to not drink. I also love that you get into recommendations on diversifying your food choices. You even touch on the social and spiritual aspects of sharing meals with family and friends. I so enjoyed it. I can so recommend it. Before we say goodbye, how can our listeners keep following you, your work, and find your book?
Dr. Annie Fenn 40:39
Oh, well, thank you. This has been really fun to talk about the book and talk about brain health with you, Katie. So the book is available everywhere. It's available online and at many, many indie bookstores. If you want an autographed copy, then there's information on my website to contact my local bookstore. My website is brainhealthkitchen.com There are 100 free recipes there if you just want to dip your toe into brain healthy cooking. My substack is brainhealthkitchen.substack.com. You can find me almost every day over on Instagram @brainhealthkitchen. I share breakdowns of new studies that are coming out, I share recipes, I share tidbits for brain healthy living, and come say hello over there.
Katie Fogarty 41:20
Phenomenal, thank you so much. This has been Dr. Annie Fenn, author of The Brain Health Kitchen, Preventing Alzheimer's Through Food. This wraps A Certain Age, a show for women who are aging without apology. And before I say goodbye, a quick favor: we are closing in on 200 Apple podcast reviews. Can you take five minutes to write one and help get us over that number? Did you learn something on today's show, do you feel smarter, better informed, excited to make one of these recipes? Did you have fun listening? If so, please take five minutes to write or review over on Apple podcasts. Special thanks to Michael Mancini who composed and produced our theme music. See you next time and until then, age boldly beauties!