Fashion, Feminism and Friendship with Monica Corcoran Harel of Pretty Ripe
Show Snapshot:
Tired of women’s magazines that mostly feature teenagers? Meet journalist, author, and screenwriter Monica Corcoran Harel – the founder of Pretty Ripe, a multimedia platform for women with experience. Every week, Pretty Ripe covers beauty, fashion, feminism, health, and hormones through a lens that centers women of a certain age.
We get into age myth-busting, the power of friendship, and the timeless lipstick every woman needs in their midlife beauty bag. Plus, why sex with the lights on is a midlife power move.
In This Episode We Cover:
Hey, magazine industry! Women over 40 deserve content that speaks to their wants and needs.
The profound shift of midlife.
How culture chases youth.
Age-myth busting. Chop, chop. Time to take an axe to outdated fictions.
The #1 myth about aging may surprise you.
Midlife sex=better orgasms, more confidence.
Reignite midlife intimacy by looking for a flicker, not a flame.
Portfolio careers, pivots, and reframing being Gen-X as a career superpower.
Bonus! Miniskirts, age-positive brands, timeless lipsticks, and products for dewy skin.
Show Links:
Follow Monica:
Follow Pretty Ripe:
Monica’s viral article:
Products Monica Recommends:
Lipsticks:
Skin Products:
Brands Katie Recommends:
ACA listeners can use code KATIE20 at Kari Gran checkout to receive 20% off your purchase plus Free Shipping.
Quotable:
You hit this point where you’re more comfortable with your body, you’re more comfortable asking your partner to do something, you’re more comfortable asking for what you want. That’s one of the gains of midlife.
Women really, really need content. There’s a profound shift in your life and all of a sudden, a lot of magazines have abandoned them. And the first newsletter I wrote was for me as much as my friends because there were questions I had... Should I be lifting weights or doing cardio? Which foundation or tinted moisturizer is best for my skin at the age of 50?
Transcript:
Katie Fogarty [0:29]:
Welcome to A Certain Age, a show for women who are unafraid to age out loud. If you are tuning into this show, chances are you are Generation-Raised-on-Sesame-Street, and this is going to sound familiar. Today’s show is brought to you by the letter P. P as in pivots, portfolio careers, and Pretty Ripe, which is the lifestyle newsletter and platform for women over 40.
I’m joined today by multihyphenate Monica Corcoran Harel. A journalist, screenwriter, former cosmetics executive, and the founder of Pretty Ripe. Monica launched Pretty Ripe to fill the void left by women’s magazines which now largely cater to a younger demographic. Every week, she covers beauty, fashion, feminism, health, and hormones... all of the good stuff. Welcome, Monica.
Monica Corcoran Harel [1:16]:
Thank you, I’m really happy to be here.
Katie [1:19]:
I’m so excited. I’ve been following your content on Instagram. I subscribe to your newsletter, I love everything that you share. When I was prepping for this show, I was back on your website, and I noticed that you say, "Women over 40 deserve content that speaks to their wants and needs." Obviously, I agree. But I’d love to hear from you about what made you look around and realize the media was no longer serving women in midlife.
Monica [1:45]:
Sure, it’s interesting. I actually aged out of the magazines that I was writing for, which is wild. I’ve been a journalist for about 25 years, and I was writing for magazines like Elle, Marie Claire, and InStyle, and when I hit my mid-40s, I started pitching my editors' story ideas like, what about a midlife shift, quitting your job at 45? Or, what happens when you go into perimenopause? Or, when you wake up one morning, and you realize, oh my god, I’m not glowing anymore, what’s happening with my skin? [Katie laughs] And my editors, some of whom were my peers, would respond, “These are great ideas, unfortunately, we can’t write about these stories to these women because our advertisers see our audience as tapping out around...” I think I heard 36, 38, and early 40s.
And I thought to myself, oh my god, holy shit! This is a time when women really, really need content. There’s a profound shift in your life and all of a sudden, a lot of magazines have abandoned them. And the first newsletter I wrote was kind of for me as much as my friends because there were questions I had about... Should I be lifting weights or doing cardio? Which foundation or tinted moisturizer is best for my skin at the age of 50?
Katie [3:08]:
It’s amazing that mainstream publications have just decided that the midlife audience is not interested in the content. I know you know this, I’m sort of preaching to the choir here, but women our age are affluent, they’re educated, they are savvy and discerning consumers, and they’ve got the pocketbooks and the interest in purchasing products that allow them to thrive and feel beautiful, and fit, and healthy. And it’s kind of astonishing that the magazines don’t get it. Why does pop culture get midlife so wrong? Why this obsession with 36?
Monica [3:45]:
You know, it’s so interesting because I’ve had this conversation with women in fashion, women in beauty, and in fact, when I worked at Estée Lauder, I worked for Smashbox at the time, this was a couple of years ago, they made Kendall Jenner the face of Estée Lauder Cosmetics, and I thought to myself, oh my gosh, this is the makeup that my mom used growing up, and I’ve used as well. Why are they making a 20-something the face of this brand? I feel like culture just chases youth, which is so bizarre because as you just mentioned, the spending power of these women is incredible. I mean, Gen Xers outspend Millennials and Baby Boomers by 41% and 18% respectively in fashion, beauty, and entertainment.
So, it’s such a ripe audience, no pun intended, [Katie laughs] and I think we’re seeing a change. For instance, last week, Vogue had an article, “How to Care for Your Hair When You’re Over 50.” But that’s one article. I think they’re starting to recognize it, but they’re probably afraid of losing their younger audience by speaking to their older audience. And I want to say that that’s a huge mistake... My voice is going to get high when I get excited. [Katie laughs] Because I talk to Gen Zers and Millennials all the time, and they are really excited about what aging looks like because of us, because of how cool Gen Xers are now and Baby Boomers and how we’re embracing this and making it a power move for us as opposed to a point of embarrassment or shame.
Katie [5:24]:
Yeah, absolutely, it’s definitely shifting. It’s so funny because you use Vogue as an example. I have a 22-year-old daughter, who I think has read a magazine once in her life. She just does not like print. So, I know that magazines have sort of iterated and they live as digital properties right now, and she does follow Vogue probably on Instagram or their digital properties, but the consumer base is women our age. You mentioned fashion and beauty as outspending Gen X, but I know also in other categories like healthcare, automobiles, and financial service products, women are making the purchasing decisions. So, it still continues to astonish me that people are ignoring this vast, vast audience.
But you know, I agree with you; it is shifting a bit. We do see women... I’m trying to think who was on the cover of some big magazines lately. Like, Helen Mirren was on one of the large magazine titles, you see Julianne Moore regularly featured, Halle Berry, or Jennifer Lopez, these are all women... but sometimes I joke and say these women are like unicorns. They’re gloriously beautiful and wonderfully talented, but it doesn’t always feel real.
I know you and I on the pre-call had a little conversation about what is real about aging, what it looks like for the rest of us, and that there are a lot of myths that, sometimes, we hear about aging. I feel like I firmly arrived in midlife under the influence of some heavy-duty fictions that colored my outlook on aging. And I would love to do this myth-busting with you. What are the aging myths that you think need to be kicked to the curb?
Monica [7:14]:
My number 1 aging myth is the idea that women become invisible in middle age. I don’t know who started perpetuating it, and I think there was a time when it was more valid. But now, when I hear women say, “Women become invisible. Nobody sees us at this age.” You just mentioned some of the biggest actresses, Jennifer Lopez, Jennifer Aniston, Nicole Kidman... they’re all in their 50s. I don’t think they’re the best benchmarks because when it comes to beauty and their shape even, it’s almost an unrealistic benchmark. But these women are powerful. And we’re seeing it in business as well. I mean, look at Kamala Harris.
I think that this idea that we are unseen is one that, when you say it, becomes real. But if you look at it as, oh gosh, maybe I’m not being noticed by the same people, but I’m being noticed by a much different crowd, I’m making friendships with my peers that maybe I didn’t make so readily in my 20s. Or, women or men who are noticing me are people who I’m having more profound conversations with. If you flip the narrative and say, "I’m incredibly visible in a different way than I ever was before,” you’ll come to understand that that’s even better, in my opinion. If you walk into a room and think, “I know I’m invisible because I’m 49 or 52,” that’s what you’re going to project. You’re going to project, “Don’t notice me because I’m not worth noticing.” So, I hate that narrative because I think when women internalize it, they live it.
Katie [8:49]:
Yeah, absolutely. We tell ourselves stories that we then start to treat as reality versus, like I said, these pretty heavy-duty fictions. For me, one of the fictions that I’ve learned from really listening to this show is that women, you get to midlife, and you lose interest in sex and intimacy. And I have had a number of shows on midlife intimacy, they perform like gangbusters.
Women are still having sex; they’re still feeling sensual. Yes, there are challenges that come along with body changes due to menopause, but one of my favorite guests was the anthropologist, Dr. Helen Fisher who came on, she’s an advisor to Match.com, and she talked about the fact that erotic love can still exist in long-term marriages, and I was delighted to hear that because I’ve been married for a long time. And you know, pop culture has told me, “There’s an expiration date. At some point, you’re going to wake up, and you’re not going to love your husband.” And you know, she has shown that you can remain long term... She’s actually put couples in MRIs and watched their brain scans light up when they see photos of each other, and I was so delighted to hear that. Because I personally feel like that story isn’t being told. What’s your take on that?
Monica [10:00]:
I absolutely agree, and I love that. I wrote not too long ago in the newsletter about how women over 40 actually have better orgasms, there was a study done.
Katie [10:08]:
Ooo! I missed that one! I’m going to find that one. [laughs]
Monica [10:11]:
I will tell you that sex rates are so high amongst my audience. When I write about a vibrator, it sells out. When I talk about sex, it’s always clicked on, and the studies that I reference will be clicked on. And I did an IG Live with a gynecologist. We talked about sex over 40, and what was so interesting was that we agreed that you hit this point where you’re more comfortable with your body, you’re more comfortable asking your partner to do something, you’re more comfortable asking for what you want. That’s one of the gains of midlife. Whether it’s a partner or someone that you’re starting to date, you’re more confident. Hopefully, you’re more confident in your body. I always say we may lose certain things as we get older when it comes to our physicality, but what we gain is confidence. So, if you can, again, look at it that way... There was a time when I probably wouldn’t have sex without turning off the lights. That is no longer the case.
Katie [11:11]:
[laughs] I love that admission!
Monica [11:12]:
When I think about all that time I spent turning off the lights in my 20s and my 30s, what was I thinking? And now, look, I’m not going to have sex out in daylight probably, [Katie laughs] but maybe... I just have a much different attitude because thankfully I’ve been with someone for a long time, but I think even if I were dating, I have a sense of humor about myself, and my body, I have less insecurity, and all that adds up to more intimacy.
Katie [11:37]:
Absolutely, I love that. Okay, we’re heading into a quick break, but when we come back, I want to keep exploring some of these myths.
[Ad Break]
Katie [13:02]:
Okay, Monica, we’re back from our break. I loved what you shared about turning the lights off in your younger days when maybe you felt sheepish or a little bit ashamed and that that’s changed for you. Something that you said earlier, too, before the break, is that you feel more comfortable and confident asking your partner for what you want... If listeners are sitting here thinking, I don’t yet feel that confidence. I’m not sure how to have those conversations about what I want in my intimate life, I recommend going back and listening to the episode I did with Dr. Juliana Hauser. She literally walks us through ways to share with your partner about what you want in the bedroom, and I’ll link to that in the show notes.
Monica [13:44]:
I want to jump in because you brought up something really interesting earlier about these myths, and I think not having sex after a certain age is one of them. And you start to believe it. I found that there was a real dry spell with my husband, and in a way, I just kept thinking, we’re not even supposed to be having sex anymore. A) we’re married, B) we have a kid, C) we’re now in midlife, so nobody is having sex. But when you think that way, you don’t initiate, which is another thing that comes up.
I think now, at this age, I’m great about initiating sex and I wasn’t before. I will say to my partner, “What do you think? Can we get there tonight?” And sometimes he’ll say, “Probably not.” [both laugh] We have a sense of humor about it. We don’t necessarily schedule sex, but we really talk about it in a way that’s really comfortable, and we laugh about it, and we laugh about the fact that sometimes, we don’t have sex.
Katie [14:41]:
Of course! Absolutely, I love that. Here’s another piece of advice from a past guest. I had sexpert Tracey Cox come on the show. She wrote a wonderful book, Monica, that you might want to put on the screen of your readers. It’s called, Great Sex After 50: How to Age-Proof Your Libido and Transform Your Sex Life, and she shared that in midlife, you should look for a flicker, not a flame. And that pop culture makes it seem like you should be consumed with raging desire before you initiate sex, and she’s like, “The moment you feel the littlest flicker, act on it. Because then eventually, things heat up.” So, I’m putting that out into the universe as well.
Monica [15:18]:
I love that.
Katie [15:19]:
It’s so sweet, isn’t it?
So, tell me, what are other aging myths that we need to bust while we’ve got our axes out and we’re chopping them down?
Monica [15:26]:
Well, I think the fashion industry has come to realize that putting rules out there is wrong. So, the idea is that women can't wear certain clothes after a certain age, or they can’t wear certain makeup. There was a time when beauty magazines or women’s magazines would say, “Don’t wear shimmer after the age of 40,” or, “Miniskirts are forbidden.” I remember even reading a journalist saying, “Don’t wear jeans after the age of 40 because they’re not flattering.” [Katie laughs] So, I hope that what we once saw has changed, and I think I see that because I follow some midlife influencers and I’m seeing more articles, but I think the idea of rules about beauty and fashion are out the freaking window, thankfully.
Katie [16:13]:
Yes, I love that. Exactly, wear what makes your feel good. That’s something that I’ve embraced. Things have changed a little bit during the pandemic, there are fewer hard pants and fewer heels, but I wear what makes me feel good, and I feel like I’ve embraced color more as I’ve aged too. But yes, no rules. You make up your own rules.
Monica [16:34]:
I absolutely have. And I think I mentioned this to you when we talked about the fashion industry. It’s funny because you see models walk the runways; they’ll make a big deal of Naomi Campbell, who is a 53-year-old supermodel. I think she’s 53 now. Or Kate Moss, who is, I believe, 49, or even Maye Musk, who is in her mid-70s. So, you’ll see them on the runways during Fashion Week, and everyone will applaud the fashion industry for showing age-positivity, but then you get on sites, and you don’t see anyone who looks like you. It’s something that I’ve been researching lately, and just spending time on different websites for designers, looking for women who look like me, women over 40, because I want to see myself represented. That’s not to say I can't buy a dress or a top that a 20-something is wearing, but I want to see myself, and I want to see it on me.
Katie [17:24]:
Absolutely. I feel very good about supporting age-positive brands. I was actually wandering the aisles of Target the other day, and there was a beautiful silver-haired woman with visible wrinkles in a bra and panty set on the big end cap, and I was like, go Target! It’s wonderful to see a woman who is probably in her 60s representing lingerie for women of all ages, so I thought that was terrific.
You see brands like Summersalt, the bathing suit line that shares women who just have different shapes, different sizes, and different colors. I do think it’s changing slowly. I like Jones Road Beauty. I’ve mentioned them before on the show, and I think they do a great job of showing dewy, freckle-faced young models to women with silver hair. And their products are for women of all ages. Brands that are age positive always catch my eye.
Monica [18:20]:
Me too. And I want to throw in the very first newsletter I wrote, I mentioned ILIA Super Serum Tint, which I love, and its a dewy finish. Julianne Moore and her daughter are now– No, they’re the face of Hourglass Cosmetics, excuse me, which is another brand that’s showcasing women of all ages. But ILIA has always shown women. I see women in their 40s, 50s, 60s, and 70s using their products on Instagram and in their campaigns, and I support them. Not just because of that, it’s a great product. But also, I appreciate that they see women my age, and we have different needs when it comes to skincare and beauty.
Katie [18:59]:
Yes, you had me at dewy Monica. The moment you said, “dewy,” I’m like taking a mental note.
Monica [19:04]:
Yes! That was part of the impetus for launching Pretty Ripe. I mentioned early on I woke up one morning, and I was like, "I’m not glowing. I used to glow. What is going on?” I really thought about it, and part of it was psychological, but another part of it was I wasn’t exfoliating enough [Katie laughs] skincare needs at the age of 46.
Katie [19:26]:
Of course, we have hydration issues. I’ve done two or three shows on the skin, and I’ve featured some wonderful brands like Caire Beauty, which targets older skin. Kari Gran has come on as a podcast sponsor. She’s got amazing products that are very hydration focused. I also love Alpyn Beauty. I had Kendra Colb-Butler come on the show. She has a wonderful line; it’s not specifically for older skin, but she does have products in it that help. I feel like I’ve gotten better about focusing on, as you said, exfoliation but also hydration because midlife skin needs it. What’s your favorite hydrating skin product off the top of your head?
Monica [20:11]:
I love... There’s a brand Ultraceuticals, that has a, it’s Vitamin B, and it’s a serum, and when I put it on, I just feel my skin absorb it, and I can see its effect. I also love face masks. I think they are really fantastic in terms of putting one on a half hour before you go out. But the holy grail for me when it comes to beauty is hyaluronic acid and lactic acid, and then retinol and Vitamin C. So, I as said, holy grail, let’s take lactic acid out of there. Let’s put hyaluronic acid, Vitamin C, and retinol. Those are your friends that should be your skincare cocktail, look for products that contain those ingredients because they really do address our needs in midlife. Whether it’s enlarged pores, hydration, or hyperpigmentation, they really kind of combat all of those.
Katie [21:11]:
That sounds like a fantastic cocktail. And since I’m currently drinking water right now because I’m trying to cut down on alcohol, and I’ve been doing these three-week-to-two-week long, double-down-on-water sprints, that’s the cocktail, I’ll be embracing this weekend instead of my usual rosé, which I love.
Monica [21:33]:
You bring up a really good point. I just want to say that there are so many women who are flirting with sobriety or giving up alcohol. I’m one of them. I’m having a sober summer right now because I just feel like as I get older, the hangovers are worse, probably, I drink more than I want to and I find as I get older, I don’t know whether my judgment is compromised, I just want to have a hell of a good time, but I drink differently. And I hear this echoed by so many women. There was talk of the moms who were drinking too much wine and that “All Day Rosé” movement, but I find more and more women in midlife are thinking, you know, this is not working for me anymore.
Katie [22:15]:
Absolutely. I want to continue to explore that topic because I had a wonderful guest, Lisa Smith, who wrote the book, Girl Walks Out of a Bar, she’s fantastic. She’s got a podcast called Recovery Rocks, and you know, she just posed some questions during the show that made me think, "Am I having this glass of wine because it tastes amazing with a steak?," or "Am I having this glass of wine because I’m used to having a glass of wine?" So, I just started bringing a little bit more intention around my consumption. And some of it is actually vanity because if I’m being totally, totally honest, which I want to be, I have some new headshots taken, so I’m like, all right, this is the perfect time to make sure I’m not puffy. But it’s been great. I’ve been making mocktails, and you know, it’s been so hot it feels good to be hydrated.
I want to switch gears, Monica because you gave us the triple cocktail for great skin. You mentioned earlier that you worked at Smashbox Cosmetics early in your career and that at one point, you got to help name them, and I thought, that’s so fun! Lipsticks, nail polishes, their names are so punny, so evocative. What was that like? What was it like to work at Smashbox? And what is it like to build a portfolio career? Because you’re a journalist, you worked at Smashbox. You’re writing a comedy for Netflix. I’ve asked you a lot of questions. Let’s start with Smashbox, and then let’s talk about your career.
Monica [23:42]:
I have to say, you ask questions the way I do, which is like, all of them... [both laugh] and then I realize, oh, I’ve just bombarded you with questions.
Katie [23:48]:
It’s like a bowl of spaghetti. Get to the end of the strand, right?
Monica [23:52]:
What was interesting is I wrote about beauty for years, and then when I worked at a cosmetics company, I realized that I did not want to write about beauty all the time, 24/7. I came to the conclusion that while it was fun to write about beauty along with other topics, strictly writing about foundation or lipstick, as much as I love it, was not something I wanted to do every single day, all day.
But with regard to my career, I have to say that I came to where I am now because I got fired. I was working at the LA Times. I had my very first front-page story, and I got laid off that day. I like to say “fired” because it’s more dramatic. [Katie laughs] It just pushed me out of, I guess, my comfort zone. I had been a journalist for many years, and I ended up writing a book with the costume designer of Mad Men, her name is Janie Bryant, and she’s now one of my dearest friends. I ended up working for Smashbox. I ended up consulting with Lionsgate and helping them build a magazine around The Hunger Games. All these opportunities came my way, in essence, because I got fired. Now, I did pivot, and I really had to hustle because once I got fired, I had to make a living, so I thought about my skills in a different way, and that was really helpful.
And when you bring up screenwriting, yes, I did sell a feature to Netflix a couple of years ago, but getting back to skillset, when I first walked into the room... I had a great writing partner on that project, her name is Jordan Roter Stodel, and she has written for TV. She’s written films, and we were sitting in meetings, and she would talk about her credits as a screenwriter. And then it would be my turn, and I’d say, "I haven’t done any of that,” but I would start talking about writing about different subcultures as a journalist--going on press trips to Africa, being around influencers, working at a cosmetics company--and these executives’ eyes would light up because I was offering something different. I hadn’t been writing for the screen, I had been out there exploring, again, different subcultures and writing about different topics.
And it hit me that what I thought was a liability, the fact that I didn’t have any credits, was actually my superpower. I say that because when I realized that I would walk into the room with more confidence about what I’d done in the past and I’d position it a little differently like, I’ve done all these interesting things, and I’ve had so much fun, and there are so many fascinating subcultures out there to explore, and I just realized that what you sometimes think is not one of your assets could be your strongest asset.
Katie [26:30]:
Yeah, absolutely. I love what you just shared about that because I agree. My frequent listeners will know my day job is helping senior executives with their LinkedIn, and sometimes I’ll hear this from people. They’ll say, "I kind of hopped around.” Or "I’m a generalist,” and they’re sheepish about it. I’m like, absolutely not. You have to lean into what makes you different. You’re bringing all of these different attributes and experiences, and lived wisdom to the equation. I love that you used the word “superpower.” You have to make it central to your story. And by the way, from a very practical standpoint, you have to embrace it. You have to just sort of lean into it and embrace it because if you are feeling reluctant or embarrassed or feel like it doesn’t work as a career offering, then the people in the room will feel that as well. We all have our own experiences, our own stories, so you just have to really embrace what’s unique about yours and as you said, see it as a superpower.
I love that you’ve had this portfolio career. I’ve had it as well. I’ve done different stuff; I’ve written for TV news, I taught English in Japan, and I worked on Capitol Hill. I’ve done a whole bunch of different things, some of which I fell into, which it sounds like you did as well. I sort of fell into, actually, my LinkedIn work when I was doing content creation for somebody for their marketing materials, and they said, "Please help me with my LinkedIn.” It literally turned into a 7-year career that I did not anticipate. But if somebody is listening to this thinking, I want to be doing something different. I want to switch lanes; what is some tactical advice that you would give for doing so?
Monica [28:13]:
Reach out to people who are doing what you want to do and ask them just to chat. And what’s great about social media, I find, is that it’s so much easier now to get in touch with people. Even LinkedIn is a great example. But I have DMed people that I was interested in, you know, learning more about what they do, less so in terms of changing careers. But reach out to people, again, who are doing something or working in a field that’s interesting to you.
I did that with screenwriting. I did a lot of meanings with different women, mostly men actually. What should be my next step? I sold a movie to Netflix, but what now? How do I get an agent? Do I want an agent or a manager? I always came with two questions instead of a wide-open field because the person you’re asking, obviously, her or his time is valuable, so go in there with a focus. Or find three people and ask them all one question as opposed to ten and let that person go deep for you on that topic. So, for instance, instead of asking one person five questions, just ask her one, and then find another person and ask that person one question and really drill down on that. That worked for me. Reaching out to people.
Katie [29:33]:
I think people are very generous with their time, and I think people are often reluctant to cold-call or leverage a connection through a friend, but I think that the pandemic changed that equation. Let’s cast our mind back to March 2020 when people were being laid off, and everything felt uncertain. There was this movement of generosity that I experienced in my own life. My clients were hearing it. I saw it happening on LinkedIn as layoffs were happening in industries. People were sharing and posting, "If you’ve been laid off, I want to try to help. Let’s find time.” It was wonderful to see that, and I’ve experienced it myself. People have been very generous with their time.
Even when I started podcasting and I’ve been trying to pay it forward. I’ve had many conversations with people who are interested in podcasting. If you’re listening and thinking, “I’m one of them,” please DM me over on Instagram or come over to the podcast website, and I’m happy to try to talk to you one-on-one, or if there’s a lot of interest, maybe I could do an Instagram Live on it. But I’m happy to share what I’ve learned because people did it for me, so I agree.
Do you think that making it to midlife makes it easier or harder to switch gears though? Because I do hear from clients who tend to be senior executives, concerns about ageism. You have switched gears many times, clearly, the throughline is writing and communications. But where do you land on whether it’s easier or harder as you get older?
Monica [31:04]:
I can speak personally. For me, it’s been easier, and I’m going to connect that to the confidence that I feel. I also don’t take things personally anymore, even rejection, which I used to. That would have inhibited me from reaching out or even thinking bigger and taking up more space. I didn’t necessarily feel like I could take up space or that I deserved it. I think just knowing that by 2028, Gen Xers will outnumber all other demos; think that, that’s your mantra. So, when you want to make a shift, all these people out there that are Gen Xers, advertisers, marketers, whatever the company or field that you’re looking to maneuver into, they want to reach this demo. And if you’re one of them, that’s your biggest asset, you’re speaking to your peers, you know these people, this is you.
So, I think it’s easier because of the confidence you earn and just knowing that... I feel more capable in midlife than I did in my 30s, even in my early 40s. When I got fired from the LA Times, I wasn’t like, "Woohoo! I’m going out there, and I’m going to hustle.” I was terrified, and my ego was hurt, but I came to realize that this was the best thing that could have happened to me, and if I thought of it as a way to propel me in a new direction, it would do so.
Katie [32:34]:
I love that, I love that. That’s been the experience that I’ve had when I let go of things, and I’ve entered and re-entered the paid workforce twice since I had kids 22 years ago. And every single time you’re trying something new or trying to get back into something and shift gears, it does feel daunting, and it does feel like, oh my god is this going to work? But if you just keep putting yourself out there and remaining open to things... I am so delighted to be podcasting. I didn’t know I’d be doing this five years ago; it’s just something that gets me out of bed every single day. There are new things that every single listener right now can be doing. I think that this show gives great examples of that. I’ve got women who’ve switched careers, who’ve launched businesses, tried new things, taken on creative endeavors, all right around the time of age where sometimes people feel-- if they’re listening to the voices of pop culture--that they’re at the end of the line. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Monica [33:36]:
I want to throw out a statistic. I love statistics. There was a study out of Stanford that showed that women in their 50s who launch businesses are twice as likely to be successful as women in their 20s and 30s. If that’s not encouraging, I don’t know what is.
Having said that, I want to ask you. I wake up some nights with a lot of anxiety about Pretty Ripe. I’d never launched something before, so with all the confidence I have, I’m also semi-terrified on many days, like, what’s next? How do I scale up? How do I learn how to approach investors? This is not in my wheelhouse. So, for me, it is a constant challenge and a learning experience, and that’s exciting, but it's tinged with fear. It definitely is. That’s okay. I’ve sort of just accepted that. So, when I wake up with anxiety at night, I don’t think I’m going down the wrong path. I think this comes with doing something new. It’s a trapeze, right, and when you jump on, or you walk across that highwire, of course, you’re nervous. You’d be crazy if you weren’t! So, just embrace that and be okay with it. Do you feel that way?
Katie [34:48]:
Oh, 100%. When you said confidence, I was nodding my head because I do feel more confident in midlife. But if I really had to examine what’s different about me today at 52 than me at 22, it’s not that I’m no longer fearful of things, but I’m no longer letting fear stop me. One of my friends says, “You have to be willing to be uncomfortable.” I’m uncomfortable all the time. [Monica laughs] There are things that you’re doing where you’re like, oh my god, I’m about to walk out on stage. It’s 2,000 people. Am I feeling great about that? No. But I’ve done it, and I’ve learned that I can do things that I’m afraid of and that being uncomfortable, being fearful, and feeling trepidation is not the deal breaker it used to be. It’s just... it’s life. We’re never always... there are times when you’re completely comfortable and confident. But I guess what I'm saying I feel like I can walk side by side with fear, and I don’t have to feel like things are perfect or buttoned up to keep going, and that is something that is new for me. I’m delighted because it makes me feel like anything is possible.
Monica [35:53]:
Yeah, absolutely. You put it so well. When I feel particularly scared of what’s next, sometimes I just sit down and write down, what is the worst thing that happens if I fail? What really happens? Good things have come out of failure for me, but if this doesn’t take off in the way that I want it to, I will have met so many women, made so many contacts, hopefully, empowered women in a way, and maybe inspired other women to speak to my age group, our age group, and that’s a success. So, I try to look at it that way and think to myself and nothing is going to happen if I fail. It’s not going to be an apocalypse because you fail.
Katie [36:36]:
[laughs] Right, exactly, I love that. This is the perfect, perfect note to end on. We’re going to move into our speed round.
Monica [36:42]:
Oh, I’m nervous about this!
Katie [36:43]:
No! No, this one’s fun. This is fun. Okay. Launching Pretty Ripe was _____.
Monica [36:49]:
Easy.
Katie [36:50]:
Nice. You were just featured in a Time magazine article about shopping. What’s the last item that made you hit “Add to cart”?
Monica [36:59]:
Samba Adidas sneakers.
Katie [37:02]:
Ooo, I love it. You say there are no rules when it comes to fashion. What’s an agist fashion dictate we should all ignore?
Monica [37:11]:
That we shouldn’t be showing off our knees, thighs, or our midriffs.
Katie [37:16]:
We should show anything we want; I agree.
Monica [37:18]:
Exactly.
Katie [37:19]:
Let’s talk lipsticks. Favorite lipstick name from the Smashbox days: _____.
Monica [37:24]:
Oh god. One Night Stand was really fun. What was another one? Take Up Space was a great one, that was before its time... I’m trying to think of a really fun one, nothing’s coming to mind.
Katie [37:36]:
We’re sticking with Take Up Space. That’s a mantra, not just a lipstick. Okay, a lipstick brand or color that works at any age: _____. And this is hard because everyone’s got different skin tones, but what do you think is just like a go-to brand where you’re going to find something that looks amazing?
Monica [37:51]:
This is hard for me because I buy three to five lipsticks a month, if not more. Loreal’s Fairest Nude, which I have written about, is a lipstick that I find works for almost everyone. I will also mention that Charlotte Tilbury’s Pillow Talk, is great. Although it can be a little drying the color is amazing. NARS’ Dolce Vita, you will never go wrong with that color. I could go on and on...
Katie [38:17]:
Oh my god, this is amazing. I’m putting those all in the show notes.
Monica [38:20]:
I also love. There was a Jennifer Lopez nude that Loreal did, and then they discontinued it. I have bought it on eBay. Not used, brand new. [Katie laughs] But I am very loyal to my brands. Clinique’s Black Honey still works. You probably wore it in the ‘90s...
Katie [38:37]:
Oh, I still have that. I think I applied it like, yesterday. Yes. You know what they discontinued, though, is Pink Honey, which I also really liked.
Monica [38:45]:
I loved that too, and I’m aware of that discontinuation, and I don’t like it.
Katie [38:49]:
We need to lobby them to bring back Pink Honey. Okay, an over 50 fashion icon: _____. Or over 40, it doesn’t matter. We’re not going to be agist here. You can pick any age you want.
Monica [39:02]:
I would say Zadie Smith. Are you familiar with her? The writer?
Katie [39:06]:
No, I’m not.
Monica [39:09]:
She’s a novelist, and if you look her up, her first book was White Teeth. It’s phenomenal. She’s one of my favorites. In terms of actresses, I really love Helen Mirren, I think she dresses fantastically. Julianne Moore because she plays with monochromatic looks a lot, and she wears clothes off the runway but makes them her own.
Katie [39:32]:
Nice, I agree.
Monica [39:33]:
How about you? Who is your icon?
Katie [39:35]:
You know, that’s so hard. I’m trying to think... Over 50 fashion icon. I’m literally drawing a blank here, and I’m so happy I’m not answering the speed-round questions. [both laugh] Maybe I’ll come up with something and put it in the show notes later. Okay. I could write about this topic again and again: _____.
Monica [39:52]:
Oh... lipstick.
Katie [39:55]:
I can tell. If I never have to write about this midlife topic again, I’d be happy: _____.
Monica [40:01]:
I was going to say dry vaginas, but I like writing about dry vaginas. I don’t think there is a topic in midlife I hate writing about except some of those false narratives we talked about.
Katie [40:11]:
That makes sense. I don’t like retirement planning; I don’t want to talk about that because it makes me nervous.
Monica [40:15]:
Oh yeah, I have yet to talk about that, so I get it... yeah. I have done no retirement planning either. [Katie laughs] Not something that I’m an expert on.
Katie [40:26]:
It makes me anxious. Okay, who is next for your Instagram live series, Women Who Turn Us On?
Monica [40:31]:
Oh, Dr. Aviva Romm, who is a hormone specialist. I also have Melinda Lee Holm, who is a tarot reader but also has a new beauty line and a book out, talking about bringing practical magic into your life.
Katie [40:47]:
Oh, very cool. Okay, Monica, finally, your one-word answer to complete this sentence. As I age, I feel ____.
Monica [40:54]:
Great. [Katie laughs] I mean I really do; I don’t know how else to put it, I could say ripe, but I really feel... one word is hard! More like myself than I ever have. I really do, I feel like me.
Katie [41:09]:
That’s a perfect answer. I love it.
Monica, this has been so fun. I’m going to check out all of those lipsticks because I don’t buy three a month. I buy like three a year, so I need some help. Before we say goodbye, how can our listeners find you and Pretty Ripe?
Monica [41:26]:
You can find me on Instagram @PrettyRipe, but you can also find me on my website PrettyRipe.com, where you can then click to subscribe to my weekly newsletter.
Katie [41:37]:
And it’s fantastic. Everybody needs to hit subscribe and have this fun read in their inbox. Thank you, Monica.
Monica [41:44]:
Thank you! This has been so much fun. I don’t want to stop talking, but I understand it’s time to go.
Katie [41:49]:
[laughs] This wraps A Certain Age, a show for women who are aging without apology. Join me next Monday when author and former Stanford educator Julie Lythcott-Haims joins me to talk about adulting and her books, How to Raise an Adult and Your Turn: How to Be an Adult.
Special thanks to Michael Mancini, who composed and produced our theme music. See you next time, and until then: Age boldly, beauties.